Fairhope, Alabama
DESPERATE CITIZENS HIRE ATTORNEY
Hank Caddell (of Thirty/Caddell, LLP), approached the city's Airport Authority recently about continuing overhead airplane noise issues on the north side of town, especially the high-powered (1,100 hp engines) 'T-6' military training planes.
Caddell said he represents a group of citizens "suffering from airplane noise over residential areas of Fairhope," including one who works at night and has trouble sleeping during the day because of it and others who are suffering various other losses of use of their property (for work, recreation, etc.).
He blamed training of Navy pilots from bases in Florida, NAS Whiting Field and Pensacola, for the "screeching, shrill and horrific aerobatics ... reminiscent of Pearl Harbor" for creating the "incessant nuisance problem" ... and asked Airport Authority members for help in finding a solution.
Caddell cited "strong Federal law and legal precedent" against "taking property without just compensation ... inverse condemnation" as a basis for possible legal action but hoped it could all be worked out before that happened.
Caddell: "There doesn't seem to be any good reason on God's green earth ... when you have vast areas of the county that are rural and uninhabited ... . They could go over open fields to do training ... disturb cows and pigs ... not Fairhope residents."
"It's degrading large parts of residential Fairhope ... to the extent it is ruining habitability."
He said he had already been in touch with Senator Sessions and Congressman Byrne and hoped to "team up" with the Airport Authority, Mayor Wilson and Councilman Burrell to communicate with the Navy about a possible Federal lawsuit to move the training away from directly over city neighborhoods.
"The very nature of Fairhope as an idyllic community ... a top ten retirement community ... our character" may be at stake.
(Publisher's Note: This problem is separate from the touch-and-go landings often seen at the airport itself. Besides orange-bottomed Navy T-6's, Air Force planes (with blue bottoms) also train here.)
Planes taking off from Pensacola:
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| Attorney Henry Caddell standing |
DESPERATE CITIZENS HIRE ATTORNEY
Hank Caddell (of Thirty/Caddell, LLP), approached the city's Airport Authority recently about continuing overhead airplane noise issues on the north side of town, especially the high-powered (1,100 hp engines) 'T-6' military training planes.
Caddell said he represents a group of citizens "suffering from airplane noise over residential areas of Fairhope," including one who works at night and has trouble sleeping during the day because of it and others who are suffering various other losses of use of their property (for work, recreation, etc.).
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| T-6 "Texan" |
Caddell cited "strong Federal law and legal precedent" against "taking property without just compensation ... inverse condemnation" as a basis for possible legal action but hoped it could all be worked out before that happened.
Caddell: "There doesn't seem to be any good reason on God's green earth ... when you have vast areas of the county that are rural and uninhabited ... . They could go over open fields to do training ... disturb cows and pigs ... not Fairhope residents."
"It's degrading large parts of residential Fairhope ... to the extent it is ruining habitability."
He said he had already been in touch with Senator Sessions and Congressman Byrne and hoped to "team up" with the Airport Authority, Mayor Wilson and Councilman Burrell to communicate with the Navy about a possible Federal lawsuit to move the training away from directly over city neighborhoods."The very nature of Fairhope as an idyllic community ... a top ten retirement community ... our character" may be at stake.
(Publisher's Note: This problem is separate from the touch-and-go landings often seen at the airport itself. Besides orange-bottomed Navy T-6's, Air Force planes (with blue bottoms) also train here.)
Planes taking off from Pensacola:
Comments
If there is any damage, such as a helicopter landing in a crop field then a claim can be filed with the DOD for some form of compensation.
Most of Baldwin County is in a MOA, and the Fairhope area is in the Southern Pensacola MOA, it always has been. These pilots are allowed to trained, with the only exception of no live munitions.
When these pilots depart their home base, there are too many of them to fly in the same area, so they fly to remote areas. However, this MOA is not reserved for the navy, any military aircraft can train in this area, from the surface to 17,000 feet.
I was a military pilot training back in the early 1980's, and this area was a MOA then, and it's a MOA today! Good luck with any legal action.
Some day one will crash and kill somebody.
The DOD airspace is based upon the last census data, many grants are based upon the census and as Fairhope grows, and Baldwin County grows, there will fewer grants to the area for projects.
Given the location of Pensacola Naval Base, the Coast Guard bases, and economic impact it provides to Baldwin County it is not likely the MOA will be impacted. Remember, there is jet training further south of Fairhope.
The military must train somewhere, there is limited time to train, limited fuel so the closest area is the best. Fairhope Airport is uncontrolled (no tower), so it shows limited traffic into the area.
I understand the noise, and I hear it too but trying to bring about legal action is limited and a lot of money to be spent, only lawyers get paid!
I spent 7 years on active duty from 1981 - 1988 and then 1988 - 1992 in the active reserve, during that time-frame I was a rotorcraft and fixed wing pilot, airfield commander, operations officer and assistant operation officer for various military airfields. I can promise you this is an age-old complaint.
The farmers get the most attention because the noise causes chicken not to lay eggs, cows not to produce milk and pigs not to eat, so the DOD is less concern with those with money. AND farmers have an advocate, Department of Agriculture. All farmers can do is file a claim for losses, the MOA will still be in effect.
All you have to do is look at Pinehurst Golf Course, well, they are in a MOA and are only a few miles from Ft. Bragg, N.C., they have complained for years and they are still in a MOA. It's funny, Arlington, Virgina has been complaining since the dawn of time about aircraft noise, and there was a meeting in 2016 about the noise. Everyone was heard but it's a time old complaint.
And you are correct, one day someone will crash, it may be a civilian, commercial or military aircraft, any loss of life is a shame but with aviation, people do lose their lives sometimes. The military pilots are training for combat operations, and they must train as they will fight.
There is a way to approach the military, and if approached done incorrectly, if a lawsuit is discussed, the military enjoys more immunity than any city or state government and they will simply turn everything over to the attorneys in DC and nothing will get done.
A commander can limit areas where the pilots train, within reason, but it is all how they are approached. I did have pilots to circle areas to avoid and the areas were marked and briefed in the preflight briefings, it is all in the approach.
So, yeah, I know what is still on the map and what is not - the area is the same. They are both turboprops, while the T-6 II has four props and the T-34 has two which is less noisy.
The reason the noise is higher is because the T-6 II has an ejector seat so the maneuvers can be performed at lower levels than with the T-34 and at a higher speed. And the aircraft is pressurized, steeper descents and higher speeds.
It is a lot easier to eject than get out of the T-34, the T-34 you pull the canopy back, then climb out and push away. Good luck with that at a low level.
The MOA is still as large as it once was. So, yes, I know what I am talking about. Pull up the FAA maps, and it is still very much depicted on the map! That's why they fly around here if this was not a MOA then a simple letter with the tail number to the FAA would bring it all to a halt.
This the problem around this area, everyone thinks they know but they don't learn to listen to others that do know. This area is a MOA and it's the ability to perform maneuvers at lower levels, and decent at steeper rates from higher altitude causes the noise when they pull out of the maneuver or flying faster at a low level.
If it doesn't bother you, great. Why attack those who have a legitimate complaint. I'm a local and this is a problem for me. I know of others who have been residents of our town for a short while who take issue as well as those who've been a part of the community for 60 years who are willing to try to change this problem. This isn't one demographic against another, nor is it political. Some people are frustrated about a problem and wish to see it changed.
With the planes and leaf blowers and dogs barking all day and the garbage trucks roaring through at 3 AM in the morning.
To the people saying "get over it" and "majority rules": someday you may be in the minority and need help. Think about that. We are not your enemy. Have some compassion for your neighbors.
There should be a required disclosure for real estate purchases so newcomers know what they are getting into. I'm not a newcomer, but it's wrong to hide this from people who are investing in our community.
it is so stupid. such nose should be prohibited overnight.
a new traing class has begun for roookie pilots from allies all over the world.
If one crashes hope it hits a right wingers' house!
Aircraft noise at the airport itself is an entirely separate issue.
all the rest of us are cool with the planes
THEN, any change to use of the airspace has to be placed in the Federal Register, then public commit period then a proposed change based on public commit and then maybe a change to the use of the airspace.
Years and years of studies, then counter studies! Like Fairhope does, studies and studies and studies....studies...and more studies.
All the airspace usage went through many changes over the years, and have approach paths, flight paths, and airspace usage is like the ecosystem, any change can disrupt all the airspace use in the area.
Everyone needs to be thankful, in New Hampshire and Vermont, they just lost a battle with the Air National Guard and now jets can fly as low as 500 in the area.